Added roughly in order of their appearance:
...based on our initial experience we are both very positive about the Manta saddle and are convinced that once we have the positioning of the saddle and the geometry of the tandem (stem and handlebars etc) in sympathy with Elaine’s anatomy, we will have hours of comfortable tandeming.
Malcolm & Elaine
Jay Summers (facebook, Edinburgh) wrote:
Hey there everyone, well I just got the new saddle and wow what a difference. After the initial set up which really didn't take long, just a few moments fiddling and trying-out. I found it easy to get used to. I ride a fixed wheel road bike and found it so different from the usual "skinny seats" that it actually helped, especially with some of the more "aggressive" cycling that I do. I thought with the wide front-end that it might get in the way when I stood up on the pedals to go uphill. It didn't..! I guess us cyclists are so used to the same razors we've been sitting on all this time that it's time to expand our minds to what someone's obviously thought thru a helluva lot. Try it…you might just surprise yourself. I did. And it works! (It does look well funky)
Jay
Feedback from early 'joe-public' tester Bob:
He's more than happy with the manta. In particular, he was able to sit on it in comfort
- out of the question with a conventional saddle - and is happy for us to quote him on this.
Re setup: from memory he said it looked 'too horizontal' and adjusted it, presumably to tilt downwards more, then found it was right.
Sliding forward on downhill inclines necessitates some form of grippiness as now supplied.
His 'iron man' mate queried what seemed to him the excessive width, now discussed.
Another post-operative mate has bought a Spiderflex. Initial comparisons clearly favour the manta.
crankyfitness.com/in-end-comfort-rules some bicycle seats look really, really odd to me -- like the manta. It might well be comfortable, but it looks like it belongs in a modern art museum. I just want to know, how does the purple one *work*?! Meg - - -
Ii'm with meg: how does the modern art one work???? It looks like somebody ornamented the bike with a purple venetian blind. How could you ride that? Melissa
- - -
PPS if anyone's curious about the manta seat (the abstract art one), the link takes you to a website that includes a demo of how the seat works. It's new on the market, so there's not a lot of feedback on how it works. Merry
This just popped up via the scotsman at first glance it looks like a joke, then its pure genius starts to dawn on you… cycleworldshop.blogspot.com
Hi there,
I couldn't possibly look through the site without trying to get in touch. This 'saddle' seems something totally bizarre, but at the same time seems to make perfect sense (and this coming from someone with more than one brooks…).
I run an online monthly magazine at citycycling.co.uk - and i just happen to edit this from Edinburgh; I was wondering if you had a test saddle for something in the next issue.
Anthony Robson
Desperately trying to get the wife on the back of me tandem. No go unless I can fit an armchair for her to sit on..... Or a manta saddle. It looks the biz, can't wait to get hold of one if it does wot it says!
C.j.Walker
I can't wait to try out this new saddle designed by a guy in Edinburgh. mantamedia.org it looks really quirky, but i like the idea!
Really interesting article caught my eye in the evening express today too... scotsman.com/latestnews/inventor-hopes-cyclists-will-sit
[a great pity it's already been marred by the stupid and frankly irrelevant comments by some anti-cyclist motorists]
I must commend you on a fantastic piece of kit! I am young man of above average build (being polite) but still enjoy cycling up to a point!
Your product looks like that point when getting off the bike is a relief will become a thing of the past!
My only question is this: where, when and how much to buy one?
Jon kidd
Hi Jon,
Do you have a release date as yet for the saddle, I am taking part in the Maggies monster bike and hike in may and would love to be able to try this out before then. There is nothing like 30 miles in the saddle up and down the hills from Fort William to Drumnadrochit to make you hate the current saddles.
Cheers
Rob Stables
....can we try one of these remarkable saddles? And how much will they cost?
Alan brown
Hi there
I couldn't possibly look through the site without trying to get in touch. This 'saddle' seems something totally bizarre, but at the same time seems to make perfect sense
Anthony Robson
...this just popped up via The Scotsman. At first glance it looks like a joke, then its pure genius starts to dawn on you...
cycleworldshop.blogspot.com
Hi,
I’ve just seen your new manta saddle in the plastics & rubber weekly and i'm very impressed!! When and where can i purchase one to try?, I do the London - Brighton ride every year and my backside is sore for weeks afterwards, is this what I’m looking for????
Mark terry
usrname: jason jordan
addr: london
preorder: on
comments: very cool
usrname: stuart mckay
addr: kildrum, cumbernauld
phone:
preorder: on
comments: do you need donations?
stuart mckay
where can I buy one of these?
from: paul depasquale
sent: 17 march 2008 00:11
subject: re: my burgeoning belly
jon,
spring is coming on so quickly, and I haven't ridden since my weenie almost fell off last year. Please tell me you guys got the go-ahead from the bank, and that the saddles exist, and that I will be on one imminently, or even right away.
Eminently,
paul depasquale, new york city.
name - chris doyle
username - faux_carnation
name - joachim deutsch
username - jo_42
name - gomalolleydet
username - gomalolleydet
usrname: michael rayfield
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname: wendy coyle
addr: clifton moor
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname: jim fleming
addr: martinez, ca 94553
keep_me_informed: on
comments: very interesting.
I am 5'5" tall. Will this seat fit people of different heights? When do you expect to have these to market and do you have an expected price (USD) yet? Please keep me posted.
usrname: zach
wantone: on
comments: very interesting design. I am a messenger, and would love to give this a shot. I've tried probably twenty different saddles and seats, and this looks promising. Would like an update on production.
usrname: bruce levin
addr: san francisco, ca 94118 usa
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: I am very interested in hearing more about this saddle. How does it respond to problems in the vicinity of the sit bones and ischial tuberosities?
name - larry burns
username - larryamg
usrname: david mundy
addr: cheltenham gl54 2qt
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: looks very interesting.
usrname: adam
keep_me_informed: on
comments: dear sirs:
...do you have a US sales force? Will be skiing the Rockies this winter - could seriously capitalize sale for your firm.
How much for one gross?
Very interested
Arcoleo
----------------------------------
....thanks for the attention, will await pricing.
Adam Arcoleo
montgomery ctr., vt
Best, Adam
name - anthony game
username - tgame
----------------------------------
usrname: anthony game
addr: 15 lansdowne road
comments: this seems a splendid idea in theory but saddles are notorious for not reacting properly to theories. You will need a lot of people commenting after actual successful experience to carry general conviction i think.
Hi,
i am on a rig - GSF Britannia & we are are just starting out on an 11500 mile cycle challenge for the marine conservation society.
Hopefully there will be quite a few of us pumping out as many miles as poss up to & beyond June 2008.
We are using a standard bike on a roller, bit difficult to go anywhere in a bike out here.
The 'numb schlong' effect has been bothering me, & i was googling about when I came across your development.
Do you have then on sale yet?
Would you like us to trial it out here?
We have a lot of Scots out here, so may be a good way to get them in.
Hopefully a few would be happy to help a Scottish development.
The last challenge we achieved about 17k miles. Cheers & good luck,
Tim
this is an enquiry e-mail from:
Paul DePasquale
Dear Jon,
how shall I put this? I need your seat.
Hurry!!!
Every minute i don't ride my bike; three acres of irreplaceable rainforest are overtaken by my gut. You have a responsibility here, Jon. Save me, save the world.
You wrote a very generous reply to my initial email to you, and i thank you.
Paul DePasquale, New York City
Emilie Taulø-Jacobsen
to Suzanne Glen, manta saddle
I am currently working on an article for the Danish newspaper Politiken about different types of saddles. I would very much like to include the manta saddle as an example of new technology on the market.
I therefore wanted to know if you could help me get hold of some press photos of your saddle in a good quality (not less than 300 kb) - preferably in jpeg format.
I hope to hear from you.
Best regards,
Emilie Taulø-Jacobsen
----------------------------------
Dagbladet Politiken
1785 København v
politiken.dk
Hi design team manta.
Please send me some pics form your manta saddle
I plan is to present your development in my
German bicycle magazine called Aktiv Radfahren,
Kind regards
Daniel fikuart
Chiefeditor Aktiv Radfahren
klick(en sie) mal rüber: radfahren.de
Hi,
please send some more information on your product.
You should also have a look if ravara.se is something for you!
----------------------------------
Marcus Wendin
Miljögiraff
miljogiraff.se
411 16 Göteborg
Sweden
usrname: gilbert prevost
addr: lachine, quebec, canada
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: i am very interested to acquire this kind of seat. Could you provide a price to it ?
Hey Jon!
I'm really excited about your new saddle design. I've booked my flight back to the states through Glasgow so, I’ll have a few days to spend in Edinburgh before leaving from Gatwick. I would really enjoy stopping by and meeting you and test riding the saddle if you have any prototypes. I don't really know how you're doing on the investment front but, it seems like a little publicity would really help - that is if you have the patents and legal end covered. Maybe i could rock a prototype in austin and get the whole messenger scene all over the seat ;)
usrname: paul depasquale
addr: new york city, ny - usa
comments: great people,
how can i get a manta under my butt? My weenie is about to fall off.
Thanks ever so much.
How can i obtain your bike saddle?
Paul DePasquale, New York City
P.s. pardon the brevity of this note, but i am at a complete loss, my dick is about to fall off, and i want to ride my bike!!!!
Jon,
All very exciting, especially as i just put my "spongy wonder" --a Canadian design I’d hoped would be the answer-- into a box and returned it. I couldn't stay on the thing. (spongywonder.com) your note is of very generous length and i appreciate the time you took to reply, but just exactly how do i order, and what is the cost in US Dollars? I would like to be eligible to win one, of course!
I'm sure investors are chomping at the bit to support your revolution, and i anticipate your very great success.
My best,
Paul
this is an enquiry e-mail from: Phil
Hello Jon
I just wrote a short blog entry about your project on phil.veloblog.ch
I run a business selling high quality low maintenance commuter bikes in Switzerland ( simpel.ch ) . I would be very interested in testing your unique saddle design. Can you put me on a list for when you have samples available?
usrname: andre coderre
addr: québec, canada
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: bravo!!!! With my 5 years of experience in research for a ergonomic pedal, i made almost the same aproach for the problem of the clipless bicycle pedal and to aim was to become user friendly without all the disavantages; so the emphasis are on these points, the confort, safety, simplicity design, human body oriented when the foot made the cycle with all the articulations in movement.
----------------------------------
Felicitations for your product if you are interested about mine i have several prototypes done and could be installed on any kind of bicycle! Bests wishes André Coderre inventor-designersøren Søgaard Jensen
søren søgaard jensen
usrname: soren sogaard jensen
addr: sommerstedgade 9b, 3.tv.
Keep_me_informed: on
comments: a few questions:
are you in production yet (or having some prototypes)?
What would be the price exw for the product?
Do you have a danish distributor?
The best of luck with what appears to be a great idea.
Soren
----------------------------------
thanks for your reply.
How much money do you need? How much of the company are you willing to sell? Do you have a business plan?
I know several investors - i guess you need seed capital from business angels - with a specific interest for cycling (in various ways).
BR,
Soren
Stephanie Flanders
Dear Jon
Just back from holiday, wading through emails, but let me take a look and get back to you.
Best
Stephanie
[Stephanie gets back - I cannot find it yet!! - she wants one herself but naturally cannot help via the bbc]
Petz Scholtus
Published on treehugger.com
“..when uk-based manta design talks about redesigning they mean it, their lucky victim being the bicycle saddle. With the bicycle having evolved into foldable or solar powered, it seems the saddle has been left behind. Well, it’s catching up with this extensive re-design which drastically improves comfort and safety by offering a larger supported surface area and improved ventilation without restricting the rider’s movement.
The surface is made up of a group of articulated levers pivoting about a bearing rail, in line with the bicycle’s top tube. These levers independently follow the opposing movement of the rider's limbs.
Support is provided by the levers as they pivot about their relative epicentres, following the movement made by each opposing segment of a limb. It does feel different... That is the point’
If you’d like to try one of these funky looking saddles you have to be a little patient as manta design are currently initiating the production of a model to establish the design in the marketplace. They are however looking for a design assignment, licensing, the right enthusiastic partner or an investor. Manta design are talking about producing it in taiwan but have left plenty of scope to develop the design and choose the right materials which for them would be recycled or biodegradable plastics or even machine-able materials such as our beloved bamboo. I guess that would be cool… anyone interested in going for a butt comfortable ride with manta design?”
Subj: manta a success
hi jon,
your bike saddle stirred up quite a lot of curiosity and i found it very exciting to finally see and touch one.
The videos should be out soon, so you can see its brief minutes of fame and the photos from the exhibition.
Infonomia.com/renacer/07/
The saddle is with Infonomía and they'll send it back to you.
If you have any problems, please let me know.
Thanks for participating!
Best,
Petz Scholtus
----------------------------------
thanks for sharing this, it's nice to know what good treehuggers can do ; )
If you are looking for investors... Maybe contact these guys:
infonomia.com
founder & ceo: Alfons Cornella
Would love to try the saddle! One practical question: can it be easily stored? I assume such a cool saddle would be quickly stolen of the bike so you'd take it with you...is it foldable?
Good luck and keep me up to date!
Best,
petz x
• treehugger - barcelona •
treehugger.com
• r3project •
r3project.blogspot.com
news: petz at renacer, july 5th
infonomia.com/renacer/07/
Wow - cool stuff - looks exciting and good luck
Irwin
----------------------------------
on jul 10, 2006, at 2:23 pm, jon catling wrote:
Irwin Goldstein, MD
editor-in-chief, the journal of sexual medicine
irwingoldsteinmd.com
Just come back from holiday. I have now accessed the site and read through the information. It sounds like a very interesting project/product with a lot of potential. It’s hard to assess its effectiveness without actually being able to physically see one and try it out, but in principle it’s a good idea and is something that is much needed.
You state that you are looking for help to move this forward, but i am unclear about exactly what it is that you need at this stage. Please could you provide me with more information about what you need in terms of support, skills, resources etc.
Kind regards
Tom
espdesign.org
o2uk liaison
It certainly looks like an interesting concept. I am wondering what the straps are made of and whether the center rod may put some pressure on the perineum on occasion..?
I would like to purchase one so i can better evaluate it.
Thanks
Steve
Steven m. Schrader, PhD
reproductive health assessment
national institute for occupational safety and health
Schrader, Steven m. (cdc/niosh/diart)
Jon,
the design is very interesting and I would like to study it. Being a US federal employee, I can not endorse any product nor have any appearance of endorsing a product.
I wish i could be of more help.
Steve
php form_to_mail: you have a new form submission
usrname: kc george
addr: cochin 68206, kerala - india
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: yes, i would like to consider being an investor in the manta saddle.
Prospects are excellent
It was most remiss of me not to have replied to your mail earlier: i was out of town for a triple of days.
1) yes, i would like to consider being an investor in the manta saddle.
2) there might not be potential funding sources for innovation in India.
3) there are excellent tool makers here.
4) how could i lay my hands on a sample?
5) i think the prospects are immense: especially since your patent covers India.
6) is there a separate manta design for children?
With warm regards
George
----------------------------------------
My apologies for this belated reply.
I was in and out of office, off and on. Then there were all these formal technicalities to be handled at the chartered accountant’s office: things relating to the formation of our new company which will get into bike business in India. (we got the name approved just a few days back, and the articles and memorandum got ready a couple of days back -- all this relates to Indian laws regarding the formation of a new company. The name is gt scientific bikes private limited.)
Then there is this impending trip to china. I leave for china on the 2nd of December and get back by the 9th.
All these teeny weenie things stood in the way of most of my routine works, and i am sitting down to clear the backlog. I write to you at last.
1) 244k in pounds is too big an amount for us.
2) even 50k is a bit too much, but we could chip in a part.
3) we would like to be your distributor in india.
You are doing something for the whole world. It is surprising and equally shocking that the world has not woken up and realised the dangers intrinsic to the conventional bicycle saddle. It probably affects the children the most. That was why I was keen on a manta design for children.
Bike racing is limited to sportsmen and women in India. There is no tour de India.
I am very passionate about introducing biking to the average Indian. Like I mentioned earlier, in India it is a shame to be seen on a bicycle. Children thrive on cheap, intellectually dulling stuffs on the tv and in the supermarkets and they grow up to be obese and lacking in common sense. Maybe the parents are to blame: they too gorge on the same stuffs.
All new ideas seem to personify the catch 22 syndrome, but that is a transient phase. 400 years back; nobody including the pope would believe that the earth was not flat.
Please keep me informed about the progress you make. We want to be a part of it.
With warm regards
George
----------------------------------
I need to reply to your mail at length. For one thing i was a little tied down with the last minute scramble for the visa and the ticket. I leave later in the evening, and right now am attending to the backlog. It's almost 7am here.
I will be back with you as soon as i am back from china, which could be on the 9th.
Yes, I do feel increasingly convinced that we could work together - and achieve a lot, not merely for ourselves...
With warm regards
George
----------------------------------
It all looks so out-of-the-worldly, and that means the business prospects are also equally out-of-the-worldly.
I am in Taiwan right now, and the net connection in this hotel is rather slow. I will look up the sites only after I get back to India. We have signed up as the distributors for Strida.
I was down with a rather depressing viral fever for quite some time, and that is why my reply to your early mail happens to be in the backlog folder.
I will be back with you as soon as i get back to India.
Meantime, with warm regards
George
php form_to_mail: you have a new form submission
usrname: howard holmes
addr: hebden bridge
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: intro came via graham barker. Your product looks good and exciting. This company provides marketing and design services and pr.
usrname: claire summers and ian bushnell
addr: marston,oxford
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
Good to hear things are moving forward. I look forward to your call.
I hope you don't mind but I wrote to your friend George concerning the 'high tech' bicycle for India and offered my services. Sounds like a great project. It has always been a mystery to me why India has not been a bigger player in the global bicycle market. All the conditions seem right, an English speaking, well educated work force coupled with a strong manufacturing base and yet I can't think of a single Indian bicycle brand that I have seen in either the us or European market.
We'll see what happens.
Keep in touch,
Best regards,
Michael.
Michael Downes/ art & industry
mylifeintextures.blogspot.com
Roy, Roland
Could you let me know when the manta bicycle saddle seat is available in the USA?
Thanks,
Roland
----------------------------------
php form_to_mail: you have a new form submission
usrname: roland roy
addr: pine ridge dr.:
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
usrname: roland roy
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: could you let me know when the new bicycle manta saddle seat will be available in the usa?
usrname: derek duncan
addr: stockport, cheshire
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: Hi, I am intrigued by your design and was until recently considering acquiring a rucumbent due to my prostrate problems. Against this is the fact that i do urban commuting in heavy traffic and would feel vulnerable in anything other than an upright postion. Additionally there are direct mechanical advantages for hill climbing. I have seen recumbents used succesfully on many of my touring excursions of the netherlands due to the dutch governments more mature transport policy regarding traffic discipline and segregation.
I am doing link exchange campaign for my client :-
totalgymdirect.com
I recently came across your site and found it one of the beneficial resources for my client's site.
Please place my client link at your website.
Url:- totalgymdirect.com
title:- total gym Chuck Norris exercise equipment
description:-total as seen on tv with Chuck Norris and Christie Brinkley. 30 day riskfree trial offer. Free shipping. Our one piece gym does it all, helping you lose weight, tone or build muscle, increase strength, get a cardio workout - and feel great. "
Your link will be added at:-
totalgymdirect.com
total gym Chuck Norris exercise equipment "total as seen on tv with Chuck Norris and Christie Brinkley. 30 day risk free trial offer. Free shipping. Our one piece gym does it all, helping you lose weight, tone or build muscle, increase strength, get a cardio workout - and feel great."
Best regards
usrname: jeremy cassidy
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
stockport,
cheshire
Fao manta media
recently i came across your website and was particularly intrigued by your manta saddle design.
I appreciate this model is not currently available in the shops but appears revolutionary none the less.
I have tried noseless saddle designs in connection with my prostrate problem but these just seem to make the sit bones ache after long periods of use.
This has resulted in me using my cycles must less to the point of seeking other forms of aerobic exercise ie more swimming, walking etc...
I was at one point considering buying a recumbent but was put off by the expense and the potentially dangerous visibility problems in uk urban commuter traffic.
Additionally recumbents are at a mechanical disadvantage for hill climbing or stowing on planes, trains or automobiles due to restricted compartment space.
Please send me further details on buying the manta in the uk as this could prove to be a practical solution for my situation.
Thank you
Derek Duncan
usrname: nathaniel "lurch" hill
addr: rio grande, austin, tx
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: I love the design! Any ideas on a launch date, I would love to order one in advance but I’m leaving the country in 9 weeks for an extended period. Do you think it's possible that i could be riding with this saddle before i spend almost a year off my bike? (I ride everyday for work)
usrname: matt hotujec
addr: saint paul, mn
phone:
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: i recently lost over 150 lbs and really enjoy biking to help keep the weight off. Unfortunately, after about 1 hour on my bike, my seat is so uncomfortable that I cannot continue. I would love to be able to bike longer distances.
usrname: naomi hare
addr: Edinburgh
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname:
addr: canada, paris
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments
usrname:
addr:
addr:
e-mail:
phone:
comments: at this price, it will not sell.
usrname: nancy antol
addr: elk grove village il - usa
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: interesting design. Increased ventilation and decreased friction might help female cyclists avoid common cycling associated infections of delicate areas.
-----------------------------------
Sure thing. You'll find a lot of support from both the male and female triathlon communities--we who cycle long distances in a wet bathing suit--yikes! There is much discussion on the boards about saddle soreness and other woes.
Good luck with your pr efforts. I imagine now is a great time to get some free news press when training is fully underway for the season and soreness is setting in.
usrname: phil turner
addr: c entennial, co
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname: earl hee
addr: us hwy 27 south,avon park fl
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: I am interested in beta-testing this new saddle for you. I am a registered physical therapist and a avid cyclist. I commute to and from work every day and in weekends put in 100-200 miles. This is the ultimate test for a product as yours. The time and mileage spend on the saddle will tell the tale. This will also open up the market in the USA.
Please contact me by e-mail for further info.
usrname: andy boden
addr: 101 dalelands estate
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname: andy boden
addr: market drayton
addr: shropshire
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname: fiona
comments: not sure how this would be for someone small, are there different lengths of spans? Is it aero-dynamic? Has it been tested by cyclists who cycle distances?
usrname: al
addr: new broadway
ealing
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
Thanks for the mail Jon. It does look interesting... But for me i took the more radical solution of going recumbent for long journeys. For the short journeys i find my brooks saddles (on an 8 freight and a Brompton) aren't really broken, and I’m not rich enough to want to fix them before I can try out an alternative in the flesh.
Good luck with it though!
Regards, Pete.
-----
Peter Clinch medical physics IT officer
Univ. Of Dundee
dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
usrname: brian hill
addr: nagaokakyo-shi, kyoto
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments:
usrname: brian hill
addr: 2-32 nagaokakyo-shi, kyoto
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: am possibly dealing with prostatitis. Also, dealing with being fat. Would love to ride a bike to work every day, am interested in this seat.
usrname: glen monighetti
addr: bozeman mt 59715 usa
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments:
usrname: valerie cameron
addr: kittridge st. Apt
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments:
usrname: valerie cameron
addr: van nuys, california, usa
keep_me_informed: on
comments: I found this website when i entered "big butt bike seats" in my Google search engine.
Only the Scots could come up with something so wonderful for big-butt American women who love to ride!!!
I am interested as hell; do you sell these individually, or just wholesale? I willet my bike shop across the street know about you if you send me more info!
So, what kind of price are we looking for interms of American dollars?
usrname: ray pagliaro
addr: hamden, ct - usa
wantone: on
comments:
usrname: adrian domondon
addr: flushing, new york 11358, usa
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: I would like to purchase one of your seats as soon as they become available.
usrname: annette shaughnessy
addr: crown street, needham market
wantone: on
comments
usrname: gillian law
keep_me_informed: on
comments: I'm intrigued. I find it hard to believe it wouldn't chafe the back of your thighs but i'm open to trying one!
usrname: thomas geronikos
addr: media, pa usa
wantone: on
comments: when can I buy one?
usrname: rob whetnall
addr: france lynch, stroud
wantone: on
comments: I cycle quite a lot, and have never found a saddle that is really comfortable - there always seems to be too much pressure on both my 'sit bones' and the soft tissue at the front.
I am most impressed by the pictures showing the pressure distribution - the fact there aren't really any peaks, it's lower round the sit bones and much lower at the front all appeal to me. I think i'd want to try one before buying, particularly as it's relatively expensive.
I'd be concerned about the possibility of theft, given its value - it looks a rather awkward thing to carry in to work after a commute, which is what a lot of my riding is. I'm also concerned about how long it lasts, given that it has moving parts.
Rob
usrname: jim robertson
addr: oxford
keep_me_informed: on
comments: hi there,
comments on your website design.
On the whole it's very good;
I think you could use some more images but understand you may not have that many of the product yet or the storage space to hold them on the comfortsaddle.org site.
The imbedded animation on your front page speaks volumes for the product but it would be neater to see the glass figure animation as it is more graphically explicit.
The only detail change i'd suggest would be to cut the margin at the page top as it seems a waste of space to have it and the banner occupying the top quarter of the screen.
It's an exciting design, i wish you the best of luck with it, you deserve to go far!
Cheers, Jim
usrname: mike strange
addr: biggleswade, beds
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
comments: the design certainly looks to be sculpted to conform to the human shape and to be consistent with the needs for someone suffering from prostatitis. I am concerned about the reliability of a material that is under constant and considerable flexing as this clearly is especially at the point where the central spine rotates. How much work has been done on stress engineering and reliability testing?
Mike
usrname: nigel cliffe
addr: bentley, nr ipswich
keep_me_informed: on
comments: fascinated by the design, and interested in seeing a manufactured example. And some indication of likely product pricing.
I am an ergonomist (profession is in hci rather than physical ergonomics) and cyclist.
I've just been reading up on Pedersen (inventor and maker of bike and saddle between around 1880 and 1920), with a view to possibly making my own version of his saddle. His woven suspended saddle has some similarities in body movement to your idea.
-----------------------------------
I’m interested in hearing more about your saddle, and when it becomes available to purchase.
I'm an ergonomist; though work in hci rather than biomechanics. I've
also cycled for best part of 40 years.
Over the time I’ve struggled to find truly comfortable saddles; best i
can manage is a fairly firm flat wide specialized on a fast audax
machine, and several not completely satisfactory solutions on tourers.
I've tried the recumbent way, again not completely successfully.
I've been reading about Pedersen and his hammock style saddle, which
shares some similarity with your design in the way it rocks whilst
supporting the body over a fairly large area. I had been thinking of
building a Pedersen saddle and modifying a bike to support it (or
perhaps I’ll end up building an entire Pedersen frame !).
I'd be interested to find out how your design progresses, and where
examples can be seen once they are ready for a wider audience.
(Btw. The "contact" form on your website failed to work for me; I got a
server error on submission).
Regards,
- Nigel Cliffe.
Usrname: andrew durham
addr: bozeman, mt
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: you could not only offer pre-orders, but pre-sales. Have us send you our money. When you have enough money, get the thing made, email us to confirm our shipping addresses, and then send it. In the meantime, we'll keep riding our bikes. You'll keep working on your business.
//
you're obviously serious. Why not? Why must we wait for the standard, venture capital/"big business" business model to work for you? Why can't your customers be your investors, too? Forget the damn middle men. This is what the internet can do for you, for us.
//
i was in the book business. We presold our books. Normally, pre-sales occur once the book goes to press. But we pre-sold our first book six months before we went to press, due to delays. By the time we printed, the pre-sales had paid for the printing. Not ideal, but our customers loved the book. We stayed in touch with them about the delays and shipped the book as fast as we unloaded it from the truck.
//
if you were to tell us the wait would be indefinite, and offer refunds upon request, then who loses. You get into business and we get the saddle as soon as possible. If a venture capitalist sneers at such a situation, you can consider his days numbered in the internet age, where consumers have just about destroyed the conventional music business because of its stubbornness. Let your customers his competitors. If he doesn't want to participate in such a set-up, he's an idiot anyway and can't really help you. That's what I think.
Other than that, have you read:
the one-page business plan?
Usrname: andrew durham
addr: bozeman, mt
wantone: on
keep_me_informed: on
preorder: on
comments: oh my god, I just watched the glass rider animation. This is the most amazing thing I’ve seen for bikes in 10 years, since Doug Brackett's hydraulic drive (powerengine.com/aitx000liquidbik.htm)
My only requirement of the seat is that I could angle it so it carry all my weight--none of it going to my hands. Thanks for your stroke of genius!
usrname: egon dubois
addr: 381 w. Nevada street, ashland or
comments: hello.
This is without a doubt a clever and fascinating design. It should prove quite useful and successful in many applications where leaning and steering occur, particularly the internal frames of race car seats, motorcycle seats, jet-skis, snowmobiles, hang-gliders, backpacks, stationary bicycles (exercycles) and some bicycles. I must say that i have some reservations on its intended use as a bicycle seat based on the absence of a "nose" and the possible consequences on the saddle's integrity under impact (should the bicycle be dropped sideways). The absence of a "nose" should have negative implications on the rider’s ability to control the bicycle when there are forces applied sideways. In certain conditions involving side impact, sliding off the saddle might occur.
Despite these concerns that I have, I must say that I would be very interested to test one when it may become available, perhaps through an American distributor. I will closely watch for its availability, provide feedback when I do.
I have been involved with the cycling industry in the United States since 1985. I have tested extensively everything that has ever been designed and I am an avid rider and I still race on occasion. I currently work for the bicycle transportation alliance in Portland, Oregon and i am closely affiliated with the united bicycle institute in Ashland, Oregon, where I live. One is involved in educating and legislative efforts to promote cycling in this country; the other is the premier school for bicycle mechanics in the US. we have several test bikes, including various recumbents and have been testing the ergonomics of componentry, as well as of many saddle designs over the years. It is very nice to see a new and innovative design emerge. I wish you a great deal of success and will follow it closely. (May all my concerns prove to be unfounded :)
Best regards,
Egon
mailveil13-use...
Has anyone come across a uk supplier of saddles that are kind on the
prostate - i.e. no horn to put pressure on sensitive parts?
There are seemingly plenty in North America, albeit a bit pricey, such as
spongy wonder, Moonsaddle, Spiderflex, Comfort Saddle and Easy Seat.
Some of these can be seen here: coccyx.org/coping/riding.htm
any experiences with this type of saddle would be most interesting.
Surprisingly e-bay and Google doesn't appear to reveal anything here.
Mike
Thanks to all of you who took the trouble to reply to my request for
information on "kind" saddles.
My problem is that I am already suffering
from prostatitis due, originally, to an infection. The inflammation is
gradually improving from excruciating to mild and my consultant has advised
me that I can take up cycling again after a break of almost 2 years
provided I put no pressure on the perineum as this will certainly cause a
flare up of inflammation. After researching the subject it would appear
that only the designs such as the spongy wonder, moonsaddle, spiderflex,
comfort saddle and easy seat satisfy the criteria.
Geoff Pearson and mark t correctly identify that the prostate is a long way
in and that pressure point is the perineum.
Peter Clinch said, "the general feeling is they don't actually help"; are
there any written studies supporting this from a scientific and user
viewpoint? As a point of interest what is the "correct" set up (fore/aft,
height and tilt) of a normal saddle?
John Hearns said that the specialized body geometry is available in most
bike shops and use the handy assometer. At 559active they say that the
‘assometer’ measures the exact width of the ischial tuberosities to fit
individual sit bone width. So this only concerns itself with the prominent
downward protuberance of the hip bone.
Davidr knows someone who has a spongy wonder and i shall be contacting him
direct but David, for the benefit of all, what is your friends experience
of using the saddle?
Jon Catling's design looks to be most innovative but the flexing of the
central section looks to be a potential reliability issue and I have
commented accordingly on his web site form.
Thanks to those who suggested a recumbent cycle, this is certainly an
option that i have looked at quite seriously but storage space is a bit of
an issue for these machines.
Some references:
tinyurl.com/h2avn "prostatitis" includes the statement "avoid
activities that provoke attacks (especially cycling)"
tinyurl.com/36pogc "cycling is uncomfortable for many" includes a
review of many types of saddle.
Tinyurl.com/2tfseu "cycling down under" - an in-depth article
mike
I received your comment on my website (pedallingaround.com) and was intrigued by the saddle which you are developing. Whilst I can see the undoubted comfort and health benefits which are a real concern for expedition cyclists like myself, my main concern is the possible loss of efficiency from not having narrow 'race' saddle for balance when hill climbing and descending especially. I see that you are based up north but if you were in Edinburgh in the next whilst I would be interested in meeting. The closest I will get to you is I am in Aberdeen next weekend. I can't promise anything at this stage but if I ended up riding your saddle then undoubtedly the accolade of the world record using such a unique product would be a valuable endorsement.
Regards
Mark Beaumont
-----
pedallingaround.com
The ultimate endurance cycle adventure; to become the fastest person to have ever circumnavigated the globe by bicycle. Mark Beaumont is setting off on a solo attempt to break this 18,000 mile record.
Brano Meres
Thanks for your e-mail. The manta saddle looks very interesting.
I cannot imagine how the elements could be made out of bamboo rods. And if so, it would be necessary to have bearing surfaces from other material.
Kind regards
Brano
Flavio Deslandes
Sorry for my late response..
You can contact me through my mobile
or skype, flaviodeslandes
best regards
Flavio
Dick Powell
Good to hear from you and to see that you are making progress. I guess you have ridden prototypes? The only thing which occurs to me is chaffing under the thighs. Also, I had always understood that ideally, when sitting, one wants to bear one's weight on the ischial tuberosities (spelling?) And leave the centre of the seat as empty as possible (perineum etc). Hence traditional racing bike seats tend to be hollowed in the middle and narrow at the front (for leg movement and to keep the knees from splaying).
Seems you have overturned all that - hope it works.
D
Great, if possible
Alfons
Hi,
Great idea! Jon, is it possible to get a seat to Spain so we can show the real thing at Renacer, June 23rd?
Infonomia.com/renacer/07/
Best,
Petz x
on jun 12, 2007, at 11:39 am, Alfons Cornella wrote:
It would be great if we can show it in our event
Alfons
I am a friend of Matt Andrews. In passing we were discussing my boss Sir Rocco Forte who is a world championship triathlete. I asked matt to forward the details of the saddles you are developing.
I have now shown sir rocco the info off your website, but i wondered if you had one to either trial or at least take a look at ?
Could you contact me to let me know.
Thanks
Cecely Holliday
pa to Sir Rocco Forte
I am intrigued by the manta saddle. The most revolutionary development i have yet seen with regard to the bicycle saddle. Please find attached my resume and sample portfolio. I have a lot experience in this industry and I know a lot of people so call me if you think I could be of help.
Best regards and good luck,
Michael.
-----------------------------------------
Good to hear things are moving forward. I look forward to your call.
I hope you don't mind but i wrote to your friend george concerning the 'high tech' bicycle for India and offered my services. Sounds like a great project. It has always been a mystery to me why India has not been a bigger player in the global bicycle market. All the conditions seem right, an English speaking, well educated work force coupled with a strong manufacturing base and yet i can't think of a single Indian bicycle brand that i have seen in either the us or European market. We'll see what happens.
Keep in touch,
best regards,
Michael.
Michael Downes/ art & industry
-------------------------------------------------
Quite happy to continue this discussion via e-mail. I personally like doing business this way as one gets more time for considered and purposeful responses.
To answer your questions i am no longer working for giant who, in any case, have a spotty record working with outside contractors. Their culture is very much to throw you a couple of bones and take over all development which is fair enough but I would imagine would not work in your situation. Also there is little profit for a company even as big as Giant in developing components. Nobody is going to pay top dollar for a saddle with the giant tag on it. I think your preferred course would be to license it to a reputable and well established saddle company who has the resources and the will to really get behind it.
I am much happier working in the context of a freelance designer and consultant. I should probably take a few moments to lay out exactly what you can and can't expect from me. I am not a engineer nor do I aspire to be one but I have spent a lot of time with engineers and I believe I understand where they are coming from. I am not a graphic designer or brand developer although I have spent enough time in the company of such people to know when they are blowing smoke and when I am being presented a genuinely good idea. What i can offer as an industrial designer is to be a bridge between these disparate fields, between the aspirations of branding and marketing and the abilities of engineering and manufacturing.
As I mentioned in my previous message I would be happy to be involved in whatever capacity works best for you. My hotmail account has a 10mb limit on attachments so you might try saving it as an e-drawings file (nice & small). If that doesn't work save it as a parasolids file and then zip it. Failing that burn a disc and mail it. If it comes to that let me know because my address is about to change (I am moving to Portland, Oregon).
Best regards,
Michael.
Michael Downes/ art & industry/
wow, thanks for your reply. You're very welcome for my comments. I get a bit rabid when I find something I like. As i think i said, this is the most amazing thing I’ve seen for bikes in 10 years (and bikes are my favorite invention of all time). I recently read that Britain has more inventors who invent more things than any other country, so it figures. Still, I want to say, before everything I’m about to say, that I wouldn't be saying any of it if you hadn't asked. I think what you did with the comment form is awesome. Really original.
Also, I just wrote and wrote. Probably a fair share of useless stuff here. But, I hope, at least one really useful idea worth your time.
Excellent news about upright riding on the manta (BTW, I love the name.
It's perfect. I swam with manta rays in Tahiti. Beautiful creatures).
It's so great to see Buckminster Fuller's comprehensive anticipatory design science revolution finally sweeping through every category of product. Yes, the conventional saddle is a crazy design and further proves that conventional design as such is crazy.
Yes, I liked that revive saddle idea when i saw it. Sorry to hear that the giganta-corp messed it up. It's the standard insanity.
As far as a "big hit" launch, my friend, Fredericpatenaude and fredericpatenaude.com (that's his personal email--tell him i sent you) has used with wild success, worth every penny he says. Of course, like all successful non-commodity/information-based goods and services offered online, it all depends on your mailing list, whose members you keep regularly informed of your progress and offers with a newsletter (in addition to your site updates).
Also, a "big hit" can be big in terms of exposure and impact without necessarily being big in terms of numbers of units on shop floors. $1 worth of information and proper marketing is worth $1000 of inventory in terms of making a buyer out of a random person on the street. Anyway, I’ve seen product after amazing product fail because the makers went for the mainstream market right away rather than the early adopters with money, the only people who will buy a radically new idea at any price. Then they turn around and do a lot of your selling for you, happy to heap the service on top of the premium they paid to get it first.
Hmm. Maybe that's the most important thing i have to say here. People buying cheap, uncomfortable bikes are incredibly unlikely to buy your saddle until they see it for the 30th time on they expensive, uncomfortable bikes they dream about. It's just the way it is. Consider the cellphone, one of the most compelling, addictively useful products of the last two decades, which only achieved 50% penetration in the US in 2003! (myself, I’ll have a cellphone when they force it into my cold dead hands.)
Anyway, Michael Gerber, in his seminal book on business, _the e-myth revisited_, says that the main product of any business is not whatever good or service it offers, but the business itself. This frees your design efforts on your product to expand (as they naturally would) to the entire business process. Partly this means designing a marketing strategy to fit your particular situation, as opposed to the one-size-fits-all, big business model of conventional, industrial mass-manufacturers. (I mean, you threw out their saddle design. Why not throw out their business design, too?)
Partly it entails putting some of your design efforts, as i'm sure you are, toward the manufacturing methods themselves. What about micro-fab?
Technology has made micro-everything possible lately, even book publishing. I assume you will use a plastic matrix material like carbon fiber on an aluminum spine. I know of hobbyists laying up entire bike frames in their garages. Or, aren't there small, relatively cheap injection molders for two-part glass reinforced plastics? Or a small custom injection house? There is a deep mythology in our culture that production must be big and expensive. Bullocks. My question is, how could you produce the manta quickly in small batches using perhaps one expensive ($10,000) machine in a garage or small shop; a handful of cheap machines ($100-$1000) with jigs that you also design and build; home-laborers doing assembly piecework (they pick up the parts and get paid for delivering completed saddles); a manager/computer jockey, and a small hardy team of packager/shippers. To begin, that's two people max! (ha ha).
How did you build your first one? Was it necessarily so far from what you would do to build 10? 100?
At the very least, thinking this way can lift an energetic/psychic burden from your project and clear the air for the opportunity of larger scale production to be realized sooner. At most, it can completely liberate you from the VC's; get your product out the door asap; keep your hands on the product and your business instead of telephones and business suits; and get you closer to your customers.
This was my musician brother's experience after he got dropped twice by major labels during the big merges 4-5 years ago. He never had time for his fans because he was so busy dealing with record label people, managers, band politics, radio stations, blah blah blah. Then he went it alone on the web, see http:blacklabworld.com last month he released a record that includes old songs of his re-mixed by fans. They edit his videos and promote him on online music forums, all for free or for swag (merch).
Maybe this way of thinking even turns you into a manta-manufacturing facility manufacturer: that is, you stop selling mantas and start selling licenses/franchises to small shops around the world to make the manta locally, according your specs, with your machines and processes, because your whole business is so tight, so smooth, simple, well documented and profitable, anybody can do it, like a mcdonald's.
The better a design is--and yours is organic, biomimetic, straight from nature's infinite genius, ie, as good as it gets--everything associated with it has at least the chance of being simple, small-scale, local, replicable, beautiful, customizable, economical, joyful. Why not?
I learned this attitude/approach from an ex-boeing engineer who moved near my hometown of twin falls, idaho and befriended my parents. He became one of my main elders and mentors. In response to my ideas, he told me, "make it yourself. Become a craftsman." he started a shop rockcreekmetalcraft.com/just like the one i described above to make funny little stick figures out of nuts and bolts on 5cm diameter steel disc bases. "the golf nut", "the computer nut", "the baseball nut", etc have become world famous (early sales were through airports). Now they have hundreds of designs. Taiwanese thought they could outdo him a couple decades ago. But they couldn't beat the quality or price. No one has in almost 40 years, even as his independent-contracting craftspeople made $20/hr *in the 1970's* doing piecework in their home-shops, with his parts and tooling. This, due to his inventiveness throughout his business and his (extremely) independent spirit, knowledge, and practicality. I spent my childhood visiting his clean, simple shop, with his fascinating homemade tooling, punch presses, jigs, lathes, drills, and benches, with hundreds of neat boxes of parts and figurines organized on tall, deep shelves. The shop lay across the gravel parking lot from his old trailer home and carrot patch, with various dogs and visitors milling around and his wife and assistant constantly whipping the books in shape and taking care of customers all over the world.
How many thousands of similar, small-scale, highly productive shops like it are there in your country? Why must that model only work for older technology? I just can't believe it. Rather than a company to make this for you, what about a manufacturing consultancy that could help you locate simple, cheap tooling?
It sounds like tremendous support is building behind you there in Edinburgh. Congratulations. You're riding multiple wavelengths. Surely something will hit somewhere, or many things. Your mention of Edinburgh reminds me of the book title, _how the scots invented the modern world_. And for that matter, one of my favorite movies, "Rob Roy" with Liam Neeson and Jessica Lange. Oh, and another Scottish inventor I’m in communication with, Vinay Gupta (of east Indian heritage), who invented the most amazing shelter, the hexayurt! Hexayurt.com
Thanks for the better mousetrap book recommendation!
More about pre-sales: maybe you could have different levels. So some people would pre-purchase the saddle on an indefinite time frame at the lowest possible price. Once you had enough money and sales that you knew you could produce enough to break even, then you buy the tooling and pre-sell to a second level of people (at a higher price with fewer
bonuses) to whom you could promise delivery within a certain amount of time. Then once you had begun production, you close that level and offer a third level of price to people to who you could guarantee delivery by a certain date (after you filled the orders of the first two levels). The product launch formula would help with all this. And then, of course, seth godin of yahoo! Wrote the book on internet
marketing: _permission marketing_, which I also told Frederic about and he has used to amazing effect. (Godin later wrote _unleashing the ideavirus_.)
You could also combine all the above with quantity discounts, so that bike people could become dealer/distributor-investors. They would pre-order 10 or 100 and get an even lower cost per unit. They could start the buzz in their shops now.
Or you sell scrip that people could redeem for product when it becomes available, at a discount dependent on the date on the scrip. Or they hold onto the scrip if they felt like continuing to help you. After a certain date, they could redeem the scrip for more cash than they spent on the scrip. (see amazon.com/money-understanding-creating-alternatives-tender/d...)
It's design, manufacturing, marketing, and financing of, by, and for the people.
Well, I’ve gone completely nuts here. What can i say? Your design is a knock-out. Best regards, Jon. I'm here if you need me.
Yours,
Andrew